AL. PAPAIOANNOU: First of all, good morning and thank you for coming here.
I will start with two things that happened last week, which at least for us, the Ministry of Foreign Affairs, were very important. Then I will tell you the rest, do not worry. It’s all right here; have patience.
I would like to just briefly touch again upon the visit of the Kenyan Foreign Minister, Ms. Omamo, last Monday, which was the first visit of a Minister of Foreign Affairs from Sub-Saharan Africa to Athens in recent years. And this, of course as you know, is indicative of the opening towards Sub-Saharan Africa that the Minister, Mr. Dendias, has been pursuing for quite some time now, and I would like to emphasize that. In other words, it is not a coincidence.
And you will ask me why we are interested in Sub-Saharan Africa? Let me tell you, first of all, that it is the continent with the highest economic growth at the moment; Kenya is in fact the largest economy in East Africa. Kenya, as you know, is also a Member of the Security Council until December for the 2021-2022 term.
At the same time, we face common challenges; like terrorism, for example, an issue that the two Ministers discussed. Another example is migration and climate change. Nairobi is also where the United Nations Environment Programme (UNEP) headquarters are. So, this visit was not insignificant at all and I would like to emphasize this. You will see in the Minister's schedule that another Minister [from Sub-Saharan Africa] is coming to Greece this week as well.
The other visit that I would like to make special mention of was by the Bahraini Foreign Minister, Abdullatif Al Zayani last Friday. In this context, I would like to emphasize that this was their third meeting within about a year. The Bahraini Foreign Minister had attended the Philia Forum in February 2021 in Athens, then the Minister travelled to Manama last November and now the Bahraini Foreign Minister visited Athens again.
This, if nothing else, underscores once again the strengthening of bilateral relations with that country, but also, of course, with Gulf countries in general. And this is quite an innovation.
In this context, I would also like to highlight the well-developed and excellent cooperation we have with Bahrain, for example, within international organizations, -we would not want to underestimate this at all. We support their candidacy for the Security Council for the 2026-2027 term and they support ours for the 2025-2026 term. If things go well, our tenures will coincide for a year.
In fact, we discussed the possibility of training our officials in view of a UNSC non permanent membership.
Well, opening up to these countries constitutes a conscious choice of the Minister of Foreign Affairs, Mr. Dendias.
There will also be mutual support for our candidacies to the Human Rights Council. As you know, Greece has submitted a candidacy for the 2027-2028 term.
We are particularly sensitive to issues concerning the relations between the European Union, the Gulf Cooperation Council, and states at a bilateral level, and this is something that the Minister underlined. We believe that these countries should all be treated as a group and not individually by the European Union.
And, of course, I want to emphasize this as well. Bahrain has demonstrated, as have other countries as well, a very constructive, supportive attitude and offered welcoming ears to the issues that concern us within the context of Organizations in which we do not participate, such as the Arab League, the Gulf Cooperation Council, and the Organisation of Islamic Cooperation.
Finally, 'last but not least”, as the British say, I would also like to underline the excellent cooperation we developed last week -we started last November and now we are moving to a new level, as unheard of as this might sound- with the Bahraini Diplomatic Academy, which is not just about training; it covers the entire reform of the Ministry of Foreign Affairs.
We had some very interesting, I would say excellent, meetings with my counterpart. And I would like to make mention of this because it is really indicative of something that, although it may have seemed like science fiction two years ago, is now becoming a reality. And for me, being involved in this reform, it is of particular interest.
The applications of both Sweden and Finland to join the North Atlantic Alliance have now been formally submitted to the NATO Secretary General. As the Minister stated last Saturday before the informal Meeting of NATO Foreign Ministers, Greece is of course in favor of these countries’ immediate accession to NATO.
It is a historic moment. They are both our partners in the European Union, and we have a lot in common.
In the spirit of solidarity but above all because -and I want to emphasize that- these countries are deeply democratic countries that respect the principles of International Law, we look forward to them bringing…, they will further increase the number of states within the North Atlantic Alliance in which these values are deeply rooted. And in this context, of course, as I told you, we are clearly in favor of their immediate accession.
The Minister accompanied the Prime Minister to the United States, in his meetings with both President Biden and Congress. Of course, the Government Spokesperson will duly brief you on these meetings.
Yesterday, the Minister of Foreign Affairs had two separate meetings, on the sidelines of the visit, on the one hand with the US Secretary of State, his counterpart, Mr. Antony Blinken, and then with the US Special Presidential Envoy for Climate, the former Secretary of State, Mr. John Kerry.
I will tell you a couple of things, if you will allow me, about these two meetings. First of all, regarding the meeting with Mr. Blinken, which lasted around 45 to 50 minutes. I was not exactly looking at my watch, but it was about that long.
Regarding the climate, I would like to say, first of all, that it was, of course, very positive, but it was also very pleasant. It was a ‘business-like’ working meeting.
We have become well-acquainted by now and we have moved on to the phase of examining what we can do together. In fact, the US Secretary of State stated that following up on the US President’s meeting with the Prime Minister: "We now have to see what we will do, how we will follow up on the various issues".
So, now, we have entered a new phase. This was a very important point for me. The US Secretary of State, and I would like to emphasize this -it is even stated in the State Department’s readout of the meeting- thanked Greece for its principled stance on the issue of Ukraine.
In his introductory remarks, Minister of Foreign Affairs, Mr. Dendias, highlighted of course the fact that the new US Ambassador, Mr. Tsounis, who was also present, is a member of the Greek Diaspora, he is Greek-American, and this gives us great pleasure.
Now, as regards the bilateral issues. First of all, the Minister underlined once again that Greece wants the US presence and, in this context, reminded Mr. Blinken of the ratification of the passing of the Draft Law to amend the second Protocol of the Mutual Defense Cooperation Agreement last week. He stressed, in fact, that it was adopted by a large majority of the Parliament.
Mr. Dendias underscored the importance of the Port of Alexandroupolis. He pointedly said in English that this is a “success story”. He also spoke of Ukraine in response to what Mr. Blinken said. "For us, our position is guided by our principles, the respect for International Law, the respect for the territorial integrity and sovereignty of all states," the Minister said.
Afterwards, the Minister gave a thorough and detailed briefing to his American counterpart on the developments in the Eastern Mediterranean and the Turkish unlawful conduct presenting him with relevant evidence. In fact, his US counterpart was already informed; the Minister presented him with information, and he even showed him pictures-maps. He also underscored that "revisionism cannot be accepted".
He then touched upon Libya and the need for stability in that country. Unfortunately, the developments in recent days have not been encouraging. The Minister stressed that a possible destabilization of Libya could have significant negative consequences for Europe as a whole. And that's why he added that "the US side”, even it has, “even if you have your plate full”, as he said, with various other issues right now, we should not forget Libya.
Then the two Ministers discussed energy cooperation. The Minister first referred to the emerging role of Greece as an energy hub, Alexandroupolis, FSRU, IGB, and so on. He made mention of the East Med, of course, which led the discussion to the "3 + 1" format, as its virtual meeting had taken place last week. Mr. Dendias stated that it would be a pleasure to organize a meeting of the four of the "3 + 1", with physical presence next autumn, in September.
I will return to this issue later because I want to make a remark. But before that, I want to say that there was quite an extensive discussion on the Western Balkans. The Minister expressed of course his concern about the developments in this region. In Bosnia and Herzegovina in the first place, he stressed that certainly the European perspective of these countries is the only way forward for this region. He added that Greece, to the extent possible, wants and tries to remove any obstacles that exist so that the European perspective of these countries is accelerated.
And of course, he said - and I will tell you about that shortly afterwards when I refer to the Minister’s schedule- that he will visit several countries in the region in the coming days, in view of the South-East European Cooperation Process (SEECP) Summit that will take place in Thessaloniki, on June 10.
Concerning that –and this was a point which was very important for the Minister– Mr. Dendias said that for us there are two inviolable rules: the first one is no change of borders and the other, which is closely related, of course, is respect for territorial integrity. This is a red line for us.
Finally, returning to the "3 + 1" format, the Minister said that it would be a good idea to turn it into "4" at some point, so we won’t talk about the three countries plus the USA, but about four countries.
We should also examine the possibility of "opening up" this multilateral cooperation. In this context, -and that was also very interesting-, he stressed that Greece pursues a strategy of developing relations with other countries around the world, which respect the same principles and promote respect for the International Law of the Sea.
In fact, he made an explicit reference to India, which he visited last April, to Japan which he also visited April and Australia. The Australian Foreign Minister visited Greece last December, and they also met on the sidelines of the NATO Meeting. And other countries that we hope to visit in the future.
That’s all about the Minister’s meeting with Mr. Blinken.
Regarding the Minister's meeting with Mr. Kerry, the former Secretary of State, which, if you allow me to open a parenthesis, was also very interesting because Mr. Kerry's office is in the State Department and, as he told us, his office was George Marshall's Office. It was like traveling back in history.
Two key issues on that. Of course, they discussed the protection of the environment, and how to tackle climate change. In this regard, the Minister made a thorough, quite extensive, briefing on the measures that are being taken by the Government, emphasizing of course that he is not the competent Minister, but he is certainly well aware of them.
The other thing that we noted, and it was particularly important, was the cooperation between Greece and the USA in joint initiatives and, in fact, in the field of protection of the seas and the marine environment.
On this issue, we expect that there will be some news later on; at the moment I have nothing to announce.
Forgive me for taking so long. Now I will continue with the political leadership’s schedule.
First of all, the Minister is expected to have a telephone conversation with his Jordanian counterpart, Mr. Safadi, later today.
Tomorrow, the Minister of Foreign Affairs, Mr. Dendias, is travelling to the Netherlands, where he will hold several meetings. First of all, with the Director-General of the Organization for the Prohibition of Chemical Weapons (OPCW), Ambassador Fernando Arias.
He will then have a working lunch with his Dutch counterpart, Mr. Hoekstra, and then, and I would like to emphasize this, he will first meet with the President of the International Criminal Court (ICC), Mr.Hofmański.
The Minister will then meet with the Prosecutor of the International Criminal Court, Mr. Khan, to whom, if you remember, he had sent a letter regarding the investigation into possible war crimes in Mariupol. So, this will be one of the key issues he will discuss.
Finally, he will meet with the President of the International Court of Justice in The Hague, Ms. Donoghue, and Mr. Gautier, Registrar of the International Court of Justice in The Hague. Need I say more?
I do not need to say more about the importance that Greece attaches to the jurisdiction of the International Court of Justice in The Hague and the respect for International Law.
On Friday morning, the Minister is expected to meet with the Ambassador of Albania.
He will then have a telephone conversation with the new leader of Germany’s Green Party.
And then, and that brings me back to what I was telling you about Kenya, Rwanda’s Foreign Minister, Mr.Biruta is going to visit Athens for the first time; I do not think it has ever happened in history before.
The Minister met with him in New York last September and then visited him in Kigali last November, delivering a donation of vaccine doses.
The same evening, FM Dendias will also meet with the Ambassador of Bosnia and Herzegovina.
On Monday morning, the Minister is traveling to Tirana, Albania.
He is expected to meet with His Beatitude Archbishop Anastasios, his Albanian counterpart, and the Prime Minister, but the schedule is still being formulated.
On Tuesday, Mr. Dendias will travel to Sarajevo, where he will also have meetings with the political leadership, his counterpart, and so on. On Wednesday afternoon, he is expected to travel to North Macedonia, where he will of course hold talks with his counterpart Mr. Osmani. He is expected to be received by President St. Pendarovski, to meet with Prime Minister D. Kovachevski,etc.
On Thursday, the Minister will address an event on Economic Diplomacy and Extroversion here in Athens and then participate, via videoconference, in the celebration of Africa Day.
The Armenian Foreign Minister will be here on Monday, May 30th.
And then - I would rather not expand though - more visits are scheduled for June, there is Belgrade and Podgorica, but we will talk about this in more detail later, but allow me to leave something for the next briefing.
Alternate Minister of Foreign Affairs, Mr. Varvitsiotis, will travel to Turin on Thursday, the 19th, to participate in the 132nd Session of the Committee of Ministers of the Council of Europe under the Italian Presidency. During the Session, the handover ceremony of the Presidency from Italy to Ireland will take place, among other things.
Then, on Monday, May 23, Mr. Varvitsiotis will travel to Brussels, where he will participate in the General Affairs Council, where, among other things, the preparation of the Special meeting of the European Council that will take place on May 30 and 31 will be discussed. Mr. Varvitsiotis will accompany the Prime Minister in this meeting.
On Wednesday, May 25, the Alternate Minister will present the results of the national dialogue of the Conference on the Future of Europe to the Parliamentary Standing Committee on European Affairs.
Deputy Minister of Foreign Affairs, Mr. Fragogiannis is giving a speech today, May 18 at the 'Atlantic Council' and will have meetings in Washington with executives from the American Central European Business Association and the Development Finance Corporation (DFC). All this, of course, is part of the Deputy Minister’s visit to the United States, where he accompanies the Prime Minister.
On Monday, May 23, Mr. Fragogiannis will meet with the Ambassador of New Zealand, accredited in Rome, Mr. Anthony Simpson. On Tuesday, the 24th, he will participate in the Greek-Spanish Business Forum and will meet with Spanish Secretary of State for Trade, Ms. Xiana Mendez.
On Thursday, the 26th, as I mentioned, the presentation of the National Strategy for Extroversion will take place, which will also be addressed by the Minister. And then, on May 29-31, from Sunday to Tuesday, a Business Delegation from Saudi Arabia will be hosted while a Business Forum and the 5th Joint Interministerial Committee will take place, co-chaired by Mr. Fragogiannis and his Saudi counterpart, the Minister of Investment of the Kingdom of Saudi Arabia, Khalid Al-Falih.
Deputy Minister, Mr. Katsaniotis is accompanying the President of the Hellenic Republic on her official visit to the Socialist Republic of Vietnam this week. Also, from May 30 to June 3, he will accompany the President of the Hellenic Republic on her trip to Latvia and Estonia.
Well, that’s all with the political leadership’s schedule. Thank you for your patience and I am at your disposal.
Mr. Magiriadis has the floor.
A.MAGIRIADIS: Apostolos Magiriadis, from ‘SKAI’ TV. I realize that the two Foreign Ministers, Mr. Blinken and Mr. Dendias, went into the substance of certain projects – you mentioned the EastMed pipeline project – so I understand that the Americans are still discussing it, correct me if I’m wrong.
A.PAPAIOANNOU: I am not correcting you.
A. MAGIRIADIS: Also, a second question: is the issue of the EEZ going to be discussed during the meeting in Tirana next week? I recall that the two countries have agreed to refer this issue to the International Court of Justice in The Hague. Are there any developments in this specific issue? Thank you.
A. PAPAIOANNOU: As regards your first question, the cooperation in the energy field, the EastMed pipeline project and everything else, including submarine cables, the interconnectors, the Euro-Asia and Euro-Africa interconnectors, the Alexandroupolis project, all these issues were discussed and these projects are still on the table. Regarding the EastMed project, it is stating the obvious to say that the final decision on its implementation will be made by investors and the markets. This is not news, besides the Minister has stated it as well.
Allow me to also say that Mr. Amos Hochstein, Senior Advisor for Global Energy Security, attended the meeting, which suggests the interest the US side attaches to energy issues.
Now, as regards the Minister’s visit and the delimitation of the EEZ: When the Minister of Foreign Affairs, Mr. Dendias, visited Tirana in October 2020, he announced, together with the Albanian Prime Minister, Mr. Rama, that there was a political commitment, a political agreement to refer the issue to the International Court of Justice in The Hague.
For this to materialize, procedures have begun between the Legal Services of the two Ministries, of the two states.
Beyond that, a special agreement needs to be concluded. I cannot recall if I mentioned this back then. But a special agreement is essentially an International Treaty, meaning that it needs to be signed, ratified by Law and then signed by the President of the Hellenic Republic and the President of the Republic of Albania.
Therefore, it is quite a long process. I am referring to the ‘bureaucratic’ part, if you allow me the expression; meaning that beyond the fact that we have an agreement on the substance and we start implementing it, there are internal procedures that need to be concluded.
That’s where we stand at this moment. The political will is there and we hope that this whole affair will go ahead as soon as possible because, as the Minister of Foreign Affairs told Mr. Blinken yesterday, this will send a clear message to everyone in the wider region that the issues of the delimitation of the continental shelf and the EEZ need to be resolved on the basis the International Law of the Sea and, in the absence of an agreement between the two states, to be jointly referred to the International Court of Justice in The Hague.
F. DOULGERI: Doulgeri, from Euronews. You mentioned the formal applications Sweden and Finland submitted this morning to join NATO. As we understand, however, there are serious objections raised by Turkey. Will Greece undertake an initiative to remove this obstacle?
A. PAPAIOANNOU: If you will allow me, I do not wish to comment on other allied countries’ stance on this issue. I spoke about Greece and I will reiterate, of course, the clear support of Greece.
The only thing I would like to add to this is that Europe, the West and NATO are currently at a critical juncture. And that all Allies need to rise to the occasion and, of course, demonstrate the unity and cohesion required in the face of the unprecedented challenges we are called upon to address.
Thank you very much.
Ms Kratsi, please.
CHR. KRATSI: Christina Kratsi, from ‘ALPHA’ TV. I would like to return to the energy issues. First of all, you said that the desire for the “3” to become “4” was expressed. Who is the fourth?
A. PAPAIOANNOU: The United States.
CHR. KRATSI: Oh, I see, to become “4” instead of “3+1”.
A. PAPAIOANNOU: Exactly that. The format will no longer be named “3+1”, but “4”. That’s what I meant.
CHR. KRATSI: And I would also like an additional clarification to what Apostolos asked; you said that the issue of the East Med project will be decided by the markets. However, the State Department has stated that this pipeline will not work and, in any case, it will disrupt the situation here.
A. PAPAIOANNOU: What do you mean?
CHR. KRATSI: That it will possibly create problems in the Eastern Mediterranean in case it goes ahead. Did you notice any change in this position? Has the US put the EastMed project back on the table, aside from the markets and the economic feasibility?
A. PAPAIOANNOU: Thank you so much for your question, it is a crucial one. Pardon me for interrupting you, but what I want to emphasize is that the US administration – which has publicly and repeatedly stated it, therefore I am allowed to mention it, I am not revealing any secrets here – supports the construction of the electricity cable for the interconnection of Israel, Cyprus and Greece – I mention the countries in a geographical order – the Euro-Asia Interconnector which will follow the same route with the EastMed pipeline, and I want to stress that.
Therefore, as regards geopolitical issues, the US has no objections.
You referred to reports regarding the US position which came to light some months ago, before Christmas if I’m not mistaken, or in the days between Christmas and New Year’s Day.
First of all, the world has changed dramatically since that time, this is one thing. What we, Greece, have stated and what we always state is that when it comes to the construction of this pipeline, or any pipeline at that, the decisive factor is whether there are economic resources available, or whether there are investors willing to invest in the project.
I believe this is a view everyone shares.
Mr. Vitalis, please.
A. VITALIS: I would like a clarification regarding Sweden and Finland and I say this because NATO is obviously not involved in issues concerning human rights. However, both Sweden and Finland have a very advanced framework for the protection of human rights, of democratic and religious freedoms, issues that are mainly related to Turkey.
Are you concerned that in the event of a compromise the rhetoric will be toned down?
A. PAPAIOANNOU: In what way?
A. VITALIS: I mean that Sweden’s and Finland’s rhetoric will go soft round the edges.
A. PAPAIOANNOU: Pardon me, but this is up to Sweden and Finland to decide. I do not wish to poach on the territory of others, but what I’ve heard both these countries state is that they are committed to the respect for human rights and freedom of expression, which are not negotiable.
However, these issues have also been raised by many other NATO member states and my estimation is that they will remain on the agenda.
But then again, it is not up to me to comment on Sweden’s or Finland’s course of action. These are principles which we, too, respect and promote and this is precisely the reason why I previously said that the accession of Finland and Sweden will increase the weight the democracies carry within NATO – the weight of countries which are deeply committed to the democratic values. They have something different to offer. And, surely, we are talking about two countries which have been EU member states for 27 years.
Ms.Voudouri, please.
A. VOUDOURI: Thank you very much. You said that during the talks the Minister had with his US counterpart yesterday, the Western Balkans were also discussed, with Mr. Dendias saying that their European prospect is the only way forward and – correct me if I’m wrong – that Greece seeks, tries to remove any obstacle there is to the European prospect of these countries.
Is Greece expected to undertake a specific initiative? Because, as we see, there is no progress in the issue between Bulgaria and North Macedonia, meaning that there will probably be no decision taken at the first intergovernmental conference.
Also, the French President Emmanuel Macron made a proposal last week for the creation of a ‘European Political Community’ which will fall short of full accession into the bloc but will entail a political rapprochement and partial integration of Ukraine, Moldova, Georgia, but also of the Western Balkans. What is our position on this proposal?
A. PAPAIOANNOU: I thank you very much. No, what I said, and what the Minister also said in his discussion with Mr. Blinken, is that we, Greece, to the extent that we can contribute substantially, are prepared and willing to do so.
I did not talk about undertaking any specific initiative at this moment. But since this issue constitutes one of our key priorities, we are willing to do everything we can in that direction.
Regarding Mr. Macron’s initiative, it is something we are considering. We do not have an answer, an immediate answer yet, because such ideas need to be discussed by the 27 member states first.
Of course, various interesting ideas about the Future of Europe have been put forward, including ideas about what needs to be done for the gradual integration of countries that haven’t joined the European Union. The only thing I can say now is that there are two countries in the Western Balkans which have started accession negotiations.
I am referring to Montenegro and Serbia. And, as I said previously, we also look forward to the immediate start of accession negotiations with two other countries.
As regards Ukraine, Georgia and Moldova, these countries submitted applications to join the European Union a short time ago, applications which are being examined. It has been decided, for political reasons, to speed up the procedure for the opinion of the European Committee.
Beyond that, we should not lose sight of this: there are other countries which are two or three steps ahead. That’s what I wanted to say.
A. VOUDOURI: I mentioned these countries because Macron’s proposal concerns them.
A. PAPAIOANNOU: Yes, and that’s why I said that the starting point is not the same. Any proposal must first be expressed in writing and then submitted to the Council, where the 27 member states will discuss and decide upon it. We are not there yet.
Mr. Melissopoulos has the floor.
K. MELISSOPOULOS: I have two questions, but I would rather ask the second one later, as it is out of context right now.
The first one has to do with your answer to Ms Kratsi’s question. There is something I didn’t quite understand. From the contacts you had with Mr. Blinken in the United States, did you conclude that their position regarding the non-paper has changed? Is there any change, not only regarding the geopolitical aspect, because the example you cited is up for a long debate? Has their intention changed? I would like your assumption, your view or conclusion, if there is one.
A. PAPAIOANNOU: Of course, there is. But the point is that it’s not up to me to say what the US position is. It is up to my US colleague to say. The only thing I can say is that the whole discussion took place in a particularly positive and constructive climate, as I said in my introductory remarks.
Ms Ristovska has the floor.
S. RISTOVSKA: Following the colleague’s question about the Western Balkans and Mr. Dendias’ tour of three countries.
A. PAPAIOANNOU: No, he will visit others as well. I mentioned three, but there are other visits to follow.
S. RISTOVSKA: Visits to Balkan countries? Will he visit Bulgaria as well?
A. PAPAIOANNOU: No, I am talking about countries…
S. RISTOVSKA: I am asking about Balkan countries.
A. PAPAIOANNOU: Yes, Western Balkan countries.
S. RISTOVSKA: Western Balkan countries then. Will Greece undertake any specific initiative regarding their European perspective? And my second question is, what are the issues included in the agenda of the visit to North Macedonia? Thank you.
A. PAPAIOANNOU: I thank you. The Minister’s tour is part of the effort to strengthen bilateral relations and it aims at reminding everyone, both in the region and the European Union, the importance this region holds.
As I said before, all these meetings will actually take place successively in view of the South East European Cooperation Process Summit to be held in Thessaloniki on June 10, when Greece will hand over the Chairmanship-in-Office. We want these meetings to take place within this framework; they all fall within this framework.
But the key message is this: the European perspective is the only way forward for these countries.
The current situation being what it is, we should prevent the creation –allow me the expression - of a vacuum in this region. Unfortunately, as you know nature abhors a vacuum and other powers will come to fill it, powers which will not have so friendly a disposition or share the same values.
With regard to the visit to North Macedonia, I do not have anything specific to tell you for the time being, but I expect the country’s European perspective to be the dominant issue. Beyond that, the strengthening of bilateral relations, economic cooperation and the implementation of the Prespa Agreement will also be discussed. I mean, there is nothing extraordinary.
Besides, the Minister meets with Mr. Osmani quite regularly; he met with him in Brussels where he was invited – in fact the Minister hosted a working breakfast for him some time ago – or more recently at the informal Meeting of NATO Foreign Ministers last Saturday.
Of course, it is important that the Minister will visit Skopje, the country’s capital, but beyond that, these contacts are ongoing, including with other countries.
Ms.Fryssa, please.
K. FRYSSA: Katerina Fryssa, from ERT.
I want to ask, even though it’s risky, for an estimation of yours: do you believe that Turkey’s objections to the accession of Sweden and Finland to NATO will be overcome?
A. PAPAIOANNOU: I told you what the Greek position is. Beyond that, I do not wish to make estimations about the way the process will unfold.
Mr. Balodimas, please.
TH. BALODIMAS: You said in your introductory remarks that the Minister raised the issue of Turkish unlawful conduct with his US counterpart. And that Blinken had already been updated of what had happened. Could you tell us what his answer was?
And also, a second question, or rather a sub-question. Following Mitsotakis' address to Congress, did the Minister indirectly raise the issue of the sale of US F16 aircraft to Turkey? Was there a discussion about this with A. Blinken?
A. PAPAIOANNOU: Well, regarding your first question, I will tell you again that I cannot speak on behalf of the United States. I shall confine myself to telling you that it was a very positive and constructive discussion.
Regarding the other issues now, I do not want to go into detail. I told you that the Minister provided detailed information on these issues and on the latest developments and, as I said, his US counterpart was already updated. He had been well informed about these matters; not only about this specific one but about other issues as well; which of course was also a positive point, as it was a working meeting, what we call an operational meeting, with specific items which we want to follow up on.
Well, if there is no one else, first Mr. Melissopoulos and then Ms. Voudouri. And then we conclude.
K. MELISSOPOULOS: As far as I know, Mount Athos falls within the competencies of the Ministry of Foreign Affairs. Following the recent events in the Holy Monastery of Esphigmenou which have come to light, is there a case, is there any possibility for our country to expel Russian monks?
A. PAPAIOANNOU: First of all, pardon me, if you allow me, the Administration of Mount Athos is under the Ministry of Foreign Affairs, Mount Athos has a special status under the Constitution. We are talking about Greek territory; I want to say that. Well, at the moment I do not have anything on that.
Ms. Voudouri, please over to you.
A. VOUDOURI: Thank you again. The debate on the reform of the European Union has now opened, following the conclusion of the Conference on the Future of Europe. Certain countries, such as France and Germany, seek to put the European Union on the path of reform. What are Greece’s views on this debate and the possibility of changes to EU Treaties?
And, in addition, there is one reform that does not entail a change to the Treaties, namely the abolition of the unanimity principle on foreign policy issues and this can be done without changing the current Treaty. How does Greece see the possibility of abolishing the unanimity principle in this respect? There is also a relevant proposal from Germany.
A. PAPAIOANNOU: There is a proposal that has been made by Germany, France, Italy and more generally.
A. VOUDOURI: And since we see the consequences of not being able to take decisions, for example on the issue of sanctions, what is Greece’s view on such a proposal?
Thank you very much.
A. PAPAIOANNOU: First of all, as for the institutional aspect: as I recall, and correct me if I am wrong, the Treaties allow for the Council to take decisions by an enhanced majority on foreign policy issues, but only if - and this is perhaps the oxymoron, to put it this way – these issues are unanimously agreed upon beforehand.
This means that all member states must unanimously decide that on this or that issue they will decide by qualified majority. So, it's not that simple, to put it this way. It is not as if we can suddenly say that the unanimity principle is abolished and that we will decide on this or that by qualified majority. There has to be a unanimous decision first. At least that is what I remember stipulated in the Treaties.
In order to abolish the unanimity principle on these issues and introduce the qualified, the enhanced majority immediately, a change to the Treaties is required, if I’m not mistaken. This of course opens up a very broad topic, because for the Treaties to be amended there must be an Intergovernmental Conference convened and then there will be a lot of issues raised. One of them will be in what cases the unanimity principle will be maintained, not only on issues of foreign policy, security and defence, but also on other issues that are purely Community issues and on which the unanimity principle still applies.
And, of course, this is a wide-ranging debate for which we as a country are being prepared. I do not have a complete proposal or position to share with you at the moment because, as you understand, all this is currently under discussion, as I said before. We will take a position on these when they are submitted.
What we have said over time is that we support European integration. That is not in doubt at all. We support the strengthening of European integration in general as a rule, but I will tell you what the exception to this rule is, as there are always exceptions to the rules. In principle, we are in favour of the enhanced majority.
But when it comes to issues of vital national interest, we believe that there must be the possibility for a state to have a safety valve, call it what you like, either a veto or a safety valve. I do not like the word ‘veto’; I would prefer to call it a safety valve, because there are issues concerning national security - not just for Greece, but for all countries. I think this issue will be of constant concern to us in the future, but we have said that we are not against the abolition of the unanimity principle.
But then again, this is a wide-ranging debate, which I don't know where and when it will end up. There are other issues as well. I should mention here, for example, that there is a proposal that has been put on the table, and it is purely a proposal that the European Parliament should have the right to submit proposals for legislation. As you know, it is the European Commission that currently has this privilege, the exclusive privilege, of proposing Community legislation. I cite this as an example.
So, there are many other issues that should be considered in the context of an Intergovernmental Conference. I apologize for speaking for too long. Thank you very much. Take care.
May 18, 2022