Following the Monday, February 9, meeting of the EU Foreign Affairs Council, Foreign Minister Nikos Kotzias briefed Greek correspondents in Brussels. Below is the transcript of Mr. Kotzias’s introductory remarks and his responses to journalists questions.
N. KOTZIAS: This morning, on an initiative from Cypriot Foreign Minister Kasoulides, we discussed the situation in Lebanon. What we all want to defend is the multicultural nature of this state, which is receding under the pressure of the jihadists and the conflicts that exist in the region.
The second issue we looked at is Ukraine. On this issue we were to consider only the implementation of the decision that existed on the extension of the list. There was a list of 90 names of separatists, of which 19 remained in the end. We have no objection to this. The list also includes the names of 5 Russians, among whom the initially named ministers are not included. Although we negotiated it on our own, we went from 90 names to 5. Moreover, we agreed not to implement the list, to wait for the quartet negotiations – France, Germany, Ukraine, Russia – to see whether or not they have some positive result. That is, our position was that we should leave some room for the promotion of peace, leave some room for the negotiations. As you know, this list is from the previous, extraordinary meeting of the Council of Foreign Ministers, during which the main problem for us was to avert the so-called sectoral sanctions. Consequently, today we had a continuation of the compromise achieved at the previous meeting.
The third matter concerns Libya, regarding which the words ‘embargo’ and ‘sanctions’ were heard once again. We explained, yet again, that Europe cannot begin and end with sanctions and embargos, because it is not attractive, particularly for the South of Europe, or for our youth. As I said in my statement when I arrived at today’s meeting, what’s missing is vision, values and social justice. Europe cannot be limited to such needs. In fact, we mentioned that the manner in which the Council of Foreign Ministers is operating in Ukraine and in Libya is in the nature of a firefighter, trying to assess one issue or another.
As you know, this is the 14th meeting of the Foreign Affairs Council that has dealt with Ukraine and similar issues, and we made a proposal, as Greece – a proposal that was accepted by the EU High Representative for Foreign Affairs and Security Policy, Federica Mogherini. The proposal was this: As you know, we have the informal meeting of the Council of Foreign Ministers in March, and there are three issues on the agenda for that meeting. We proposed the addition of a fourth issue, concerning the stabilization and comprehensive confrontation of the problems in the Eastern Mediterranean. We cannot continue to talk now about Libya, now about Syria, about Iraq, Lebanon, without a comprehensive strategy.
This includes two elements, according to our outlook on foreign policy: The first is that each country cannot be dealt with in isolation, with different policies and strategies, depending on who the given country has as a protector of enemy in the region. What is needed is a cohesive policy that helps overcome the problems the region is facing – from educational programs to social services programs.
The fourth matter we looked at was terrorism. The text was essentially agreed upon. Our stance concerned a special problem: the Christian populations and communities, and the cultural heritage that is being lost in the Middle East. This issue has escaped notice, and it doesn’t just concern the need to protect the Christian populations or the protection of the region’s cultural heritage, which is being used by the jihadists as a means to raising large sums. It also concerns the extent to which the region’s multiculturalism and multifaith nature will survive after evolving over thousands of years, sometime with difficulties, but also with a sense of tolerance among the populations.
The last matter discussed, very briefly, was with regard to Yemen, and it concerned an effort to stabilize the region as much as possible. The consideration of the Yemen issue also confirms the line followed by Greek foreign policy: that Europe cannot stop at the Russia-Ukraine conflict. Europe has too look at the problems of the south. Although the matter of Russian-Ukrainian relations really is a major problem for the stability of Europe, the problem of the waves of jihadists and the people seeking to migrate to Europe for a better life and better work and economic prospects is not just around us, but is penetrating ever more into Europe itself. As a result, one cannot ignore this from northern Europe and not have an immediate sense of this situation.
These were the issues we looked at today, while most of the debate was taken up by the issue of the implementation of the decision on Ukraine. The rest of the issues were considered briefly. Tomorrow we will be represented at the EU General Affairs Council by Greece’s Permanent Representative to the EU, Ambassador A. Papadoupoulou, and the Prime Minister will be coming to Brussels on Thursday, 12 February.
Mr. Kotzias’s introductory remarks were followed by questions from journalists.
To a question regarding the purpose of his trip to Berlin, Foreign Minister Kotzias responded: “Ten days ago, German Foreign Minister Steinmeier asked me for a meeting. I think that at the time we had a very good discussion. I saw the German Ambassador twice in Athens – the last time was on Friday, when I also met with the U.S. Ambassador. We agreed to talk about Greek-German cooperation, as well as about ways to confront certain problems in Europe, like the problem between Russia and Ukraine. I have the sense that Germany is very interested in find a way to contribute to improving its image in Greece. In this context, today I am giving what is essentially my first interview as Foreign Minister, to Spiegel magazine, on the familiar issues. It is a discussion regarding the manner of cooperation, improvement of our communication and our image, as well as the consideration of the major problems in Europe: The obvious problem of Russia-Ukraine, but also the issue of the Middle East and of terrorism – matters that we also discuss in the Council. In general, we want to be in ongoing contact with Mr. Steinmeier, as we do with most or all of the Foreign Ministers.
I must say that, despite the barrage of attacks this government and I, personally, have come under, the willingness to cooperate, converse and seek paths of support for Greece and of understanding for Greek foreign policy, as well as our policy as a whole, is great. Of course, due to the nature of their work, the Foreign Ministers pursue negotiation and mutual understanding more than they do the use of other means. I’ll open an academic parenthesis. There is a wonderful discussion with Graham Allison, at Harvard, who has analyzed the Cuban crisis, making a comparison of the conduct of the U.S. State Department and the Department of Defence. The U.S. Department of Defence saw the missiles that it had to send to vanquish the enemy. The State Department saw diplomats negotiating. Each ministry has its own method, so perhaps this is also a good space where the Foreign Ministry and I, personally, as the Foreign Minister, can contribute to opening the way so that the country can have some breathing room with regard to the other negotiations.
I have to say that the Prime Minister’s trip to Austria was very good. It was an exceptionally good discussion. The Austrian Chancellor gave a good outlook. To have good negotiations, we need to have some allies who will not allow us to be isolated. Our policy is a policy of alliances. We believe that we have right on our side and that there are countries that have the same views; views that they did not express. Today, Greece can become a catalyst for their expressing those views, and we can convince certain states and certain European institutions so that we can have more rational negotiations.
Allow me to open a second parenthesis. The general negotiation we are carrying out concerns our policy: that we do not accept the continuation of the implementation of these policies. The way this is interpreted by the international media and some – luckily, a few – foreign players is that we don’t want to pay. We are saying that these policies cannot be implemented because they are catastrophic and we cannot continue them, while they don’t tell their people that their policies were catastrophic, but that they were wonderfully successful and that we simply don’t want to pay. We’re ‘dodging’ our debts, as they say. I think there are states and institutions that have been convinced that we are right and that have been convinced of what the real problem is.”
Concerning the extent to which the list the Foreign Affairs Council adopted with regard to Ukraine will be published directly, Foreign Minister Kotzias noted that “regarding the list of persons, on Monday, and having first seen the results of Minsk. If the results are positive, the decision may be overturned.”
In response to a journalist’s question concerning the prospect of the Prime Minister visiting Berlin, Mr. Kotzias replied that “no such visit has been scheduled. We will see whether and how there can be talks with Mrs. Merkel. I have the sense that German diplomacy would like the Prime Minister to have a relevant conversation with Mrs. Merkel, but we would also like Germany to understand that it isn’t the New Rome, but a strong, interested and, we hope, friendly country with regard to Greece. I have told the Germans that we see Germany as a friendly country with an unfriendly policy. We have nothing against Germany. But we have much against the policy it is following on Greece.”
To a journalist’s question regarding the likelihood of a meeting between the Prime Minister and the German Chancellor on the margins of the meeting of the European Council, Foreign Minister Kotzias responded that he was “not aware of the Prime Minister’s schedule. But, as you know, scheduling isn’t necessary at the Summit Meeting – meetings take place. But I am not aware of anything having been scheduled at this time.”
To the next question – the extent to which Greece has allies in the negotiations that are taking place – Mr. Kotzias replied that “there are allies who are not always visible, like those who voted in favor of our views at the meeting of the Governing Council of the European Central Bank. The minutes aren’t made public, but one of those allies on this issue is the country we’re in right now.”
Asked whether he intends to carry out another trip within the week, apart from his visit to Berlin – to Russia, for instance – Mr. Kotzias responded that he will “be back in Brussels on Thursday, that’s for sure. We’ll see in Berlin what other trip I might be taking.”
Mr. Kotzias then noted that, despite the personal attacks carried out against him as Foreign Minister, “these attacks are not impacting our negotiating tactics and are not impacting our views. I think the international factor as a whole has received the Greek government’s message, and the Prime Minister was very clear in the Hellenic Parliament that we are not backing down. We aren’t saying this because we’ve dug in or because we are angry with anyone. We say this because we cannot lead the Greek people into further suffering. Our problem with the way certain states express policy is that they are trying to gloss over the moral side of the failure of this simplistic math. The numbers show that, from the multiplier to the deficit policy, the country was destroyed, the social fabric was destroyed, the productive fabric was destroyed, and we have soaring levels of unemployment.
I just heard the discussion on the countries with a Muslim or Arab make-up, and it was mentioned that youth unemployment is at 30%, and that this is what is engendering terrorism. And I thought, in our country we are at over 50%, but we have a culture of dialogue, democratic institutions, and a good government today. I think that we have taken a positive step, showing that the government has a ready pragmatism, and they are showing realism. What I always say, and this annoys some, is that when the foreigners pressure us to gain a better position in the negotiations that are beginning, the media in Greece panic. The foreigners are negotiating. The Greeks who parrot this pressure, I haven’t understood exactly what they are doing. Are they negotiating on the side of the foreigners? Are they celebrating?”
The Minister then sharply criticized the stance of the foreign news media on the new government, as well as against him, personally, for alleged special relations with Russia, and he noted that the international press needs to handle the situation seriously, commenting that “I think it is helpful on this matter that we have a serious government that confronts things in a serious manner.”
“Two of our serious demands were satisfied today,” he continued. “As I was promised by the EU High Representative for Foreign Affairs and Security Policy, Federica Mogherini, there will be a programme for protection of the Christian communities in the Middle East. Also, the request for adding the issue of the Mediterranean, its security and development, to the agenda for the informal meeting of the EU Foreign Affairs Council was accepted as well. All that’s left is for the Foreign Ministry to work effectively to offer good ideas, so that we can be properly prepared ahead of the informal meeting of the EU Foreign Affairs Council.”
February 9, 2015