JOURNALIST: Minister, do you think the step taken in Berlin lays firm foundations for the resolution of the Libyan crisis?
N. DENDIAS: The results of the Berlin Conference are a first, hesitant step towards resolution of the Libyan crisis. The Conference reconfirmed the will of all sides to achieve a political solution and the need for full implementation of the arms embargo in Libya. But it is only a first step, and not the culmination of the process. We are waiting to see how the ‘Berlin Process’ evolves, and we expect to contribute to it. Greece played an very constructive role in the time leading up to the Conference, through its proactive diplomacy and its meetings with Field Marshal Haftar – whom we urged to go to the negotiations in a positive spirit – and the states of the region. Beyond that, we look positively on a possible reactivation and expansion of ‘operation Sophia’, under any new name, to monitor compliance with the arms embargo in Libya, as well as the potential deployment of a UN peacekeeping force. Greece is prepared to contribute to both initiatives.
JOURNALIST: Greece supports the prospect of a political solution in Libya. What content might this have with regard to the two Turkey-Libya memoranda?
N. DENDIAS: The memoranda signed by Turkey and the government in Tripoli cannot have a place in the political solution of the Libyan crisis. First, because they were concluded in an illegal manner and, second, because their content itself runs counter to international law and the resolutions of the UN Security Council. As such, they are null and void, and as such, they cannot have legal effects. This is not just Greece’s view, but also that of the Libyan House of Representatives, to sole elected and internationally recognized state body, which understands that these memoranda are damaging to the country and its citizens. This view is shared by many other countries, including Egypt, Saudi Arabia, Morocco, the United Arab Emirates, Israel, the U.S., and all the member states of the EU. I must stress that we see it as somewhat incomprehensible that, first, the conclusions of the Berlin Conference make no reference to the fact that the memoranda are null and void and, second, that the EU officials who attended the Conference did not insist on such a reference. But the memoranda are essentially a blatant outside intervention in Libya. The defence of the common European position, as decided upon at the latest meeting of the European Council, is absolutely binding for all of us.
JOURNALIST: Following your absence from the recent conference – regarding which you expressed your dismay and were criticized by the main opposition party – do you think the right conditions are being created for Greece’s presence in the next stages of the process?
N. DENDIAS: Greece showed a constructive spirit throughout the time leading up to the Berlin Conference. It maintains effective channels of communication with Field Marshal Haftar, whom we urged to agree to the ceasefire so that there could be progress towards finding a way out of the Libyan crisis. As a neighbour of Libya and as a state with a significant geopolitical presence in the region, our country has the right to participate in the process. In contrast, there are understandable doubts about Turkey’s participation in a process aimed at bringing peace to Libya, as Turkey systematically violates international law, creates problems with all the states of the Eastern Mediterranean, is actively involved in Libya’s internal conflict – providing military support for one of the two sides – is not a neighbouring state and is not a member of the UN Security Council. Whatever Turkey does, it can’t change geography, and it will be haunted by this problem.
JOURNALIST: Germany did not invite Greece to the conference, but Mr. Erdogan claims there are meetings with Italy regarding drilling in the context of the Libya agreement. Are you concerned that the interests of individual countries might jeopardise Europe’s common line on this issue?
N. DENDIAS: As you will have seen, the Italian Ministry of Foreign Affairs expressly and categorically denied any rumours about contacts between Italy and Turkey over drilling. It is natural for every country to look after its interests. However, allow me to point out that the recent decision from the European Council was a unanimous decision taken by the heads of state and government of the EU member states. In other words, each country, weighing its interests, agreed to the European Council decision. So, the common European line you are referring to is in fact also the individual line of each member state of the European Union. Italy, a country with close ties to Greece, has repeatedly come out in favour of Greece's positions. In any case, as the Prime Minister himself said recently, any divergence from our common European line will naturally run up against our right of veto.
JOURNALIST: What kind of peacekeeping mission in Libya would Greece be willing to participate in?
N. DENDIAS: Greece is willing to participate in any joint effort to achieve peace and stability in Libya. At the Berlin Conference, there was a discussion of reactivating the European naval operation ‘Sophia’, under another name, to oversee compliance with the arms embargo in Libya, and, provided a permanent ceasefire is achieved, sending a force to oversee the implementation of the ceasefire, with a mandate from the UN Security Council. As a responsible state, our country will participate in the joint efforts to resolve the Libyan crisis with every means at its disposal.
JOURNALIST: We are seeing an escalation in rhetoric on the part of Mr. Erdogan, which peaked following Mr. Haftar’s visit to Athens and is continuing after Berlin. What do you attribute this to, and how will the Greek side respond?
N. DENDIAS: President Erdogan’s frustration is understandable. Greece is exercising a proactive foreign policy and maintains close ties with the Eastern Mediterranean states, while Turkey has problems with almost all of these states. So his frustration is very understandable. But the Greek side will not alter its course. It will continue to defend international legality, its interests, and peace and stability in the region, in collaboration with all neighbouring states. Our country is a factor for stability in the Mediterranean region, and this has been recognized internationally. Meanwhile, Turkey has emerged as an exporter of problems and instability and a repeat violator of legality.
JOURNALIST: Could all this tension block the channels of communication between Greece and Turkey.
N. DENDIAS: If the channels of dialogue between Greek and Turkey are blocked, it will not be due to us. Our country has shown that, in spite of the tensions, in spite of Turkey’s repeated provocations and illegal actions against our country, in spite of Turkey’s constant efforts to project power in the wider region, it is willing to maintain the dialogue and it wants discuss the problems that exist. After all, it is in the interest of both sides to continue the dialogue and reach and understanding. I have said repeatedly that Greece wants a European Turkey that is part of the international community, peaceful and prosperous. In this context, we will not stop pursuing dialogue with our neighbouring country, as we do with all our other neighbours.
JOURNALIST: Under what conditions and why might the Greek side pursue an application to The Hague?
N. DENDIAS: Greek foreign policy is guided by international law. As such, our country would be in favour of applying to an international court to resolve its differences with Turkey. And there has been a relevant discussion in the past, but in the end, Turkey backed out. But to get to that point, both sides will have to agree on what their dispute is. For our country, it is clear what our dispute is.
JOURNALIST: We see that, with regard to the two ‘memoranda’, Greece is investing in its relationship with France. If fact, the prime minister will be visiting Paris soon. Are you convinced that the Greek-French alliance holds for this issue?
N. DENDIAS: France has been a true ally and friend to Greece, even before the era of Giscard d’Estaing and the fall of the dictatorship, when the ‘Greece-France, allies’ motto was first used. And today, the French President, Mr. Macron, has shown practical support for Greece, and the Greek Prime Minister will visit him to talk about all the region’s issues. My French counterpart, Mr. Le Drian – whom I have talked to repeatedly – has been equally supportive. So, I believe that on this issue, too, France will continue to support Greece, not out of some fixation, but because France sees that our country serves international law and peace in the region, which, by extension, is in France’s interest. But note that Greece also counts other countries as its friends and allies.
JOURNALIST: You carried out a series of visits to Arab countries recently. Will these initiatives continue, and what are they aimed at?
N. DENDIAS: The diplomatic marathon that is under way will certainly continue. In this context, I recently received my counterpart from Saudi Arabia at the Ministry of Foreign Affairs, and I will continue my visits to countries in the region and beyond, to enhance our alliances and communicate Greece’s positions to the international community. Our goal is to promote our positions abroad, and the understanding of third countries, as much as possible, leaving no room for the promotion of positions that are clearly outside the framework of international legality.
JOURNALIST: Following the prime minister’s recent meetings with the leaders of the political parties, do you feel there is a united front on national issues?
N. DENDIAS: To a great extent, the opposition parties in Greece have shown a great deal of consensus on foreign policy issues, and, as the Minister of Foreign Affairs, I am grateful for this. You know, Mr. Chondropoulos, it is an important sign of maturity of the political system that these issues can be left out of party politics, because it is only through national unity and consensus that we can deal with these issues successfully. It is important for a Minister of Foreign Affairs to know that he has the broad support of politicians, and, let’s not fool ourselves, every success in our foreign policy is not a success for the given minister or the party in power, but for the whole country. So, I won’t hide my surprise at the stance taken by the main opposition party on the issue of the amended defence agreement with the U.S.; a development that the previous government had started working towards. Of course, the end result that we signed in October, after two and a half months of painstaking negotiations, was very positive for our national interests. The truth is that, in the end, the Agreement was more beneficial to our national interests than what was being discussed under the previous government. And I don’t say this to be critical of the previous government, which also moved in the direction of national gains on this particular issue, but to underscore that there is no reason for Syriza to oppose this agreement. That’s why I’m so surprised and can’t understand why they don’t support it. In any event, I hope we continue with a satisfactory level of national unity.
January 26, 2020