F. W. STEINMEIER: There is much linking Greece and Germany. Greece is without a doubt the cradle of our western civilization: its language, its philosophy, its worldview.
All of these are deeply etched in European history and culture. We will not discuss only fundamental issues. Everything that is happening today will be the subject of our talks, which will start shortly. And naturally (we will discuss) the major issues of foreign policy that we looked at this past weekend, during the Munich Security Conference. Among these issues is the situation in Ukraine, or the relationship with Russia, the crisis in the Middle East, from Syria and Iraq to the Middle East peace process – these are all causing us great concern. Refugees are another issue of great concern. Greece, of course, due to its geographical position, is in a special situation with regard to these worrying issues, as it neighbours on the region.
We will also discuss the potential for finding a solution. But, Nikos, we will also talk about today’s issues and the content of the talks between the Greek government and the European Commission. The change in course made by the new government of Alexis Tsipras on social and economic issues is prompting debates. This is nothing new, and we hear it like you do, on the evening news. Some statements raised questions, and we are awaiting with great interest the proposals that will be made in the coming days by the Greek government on pending issues: whether or not there will be an extension of the existing programme, whether there are ideas and proposals – if possible, specific ones – from the Greek government.
What I said at our first meeting, ten days ago, still holds: Greece voted. The result is clear. The new government has the majority. We respect all of this. On the other hand, though, we expect that it is respected in Greece that there must be credibility and compliance with what has been agreed. What is important today is not that we stress our positions in more drastic language. What is important is that we find out, through discussion, what the other side’s ideas are on economic policy issues.
Thank you for coming to Berlin.
I would like to add something more regarding the current situation in Ukraine. The coming days and hours will be of decisive importance. In conversations and teleconferences that have taken place in recent days between the heads of state and government and the Foreign Minister of Russia, France, Germany and Ukraine, and in the negotiations that began yesterday and will continue tonight and tomorrow in Minsk. I don’t want to assess these talks, which were meaningful, I think. But there are still many pending issues that will have to be resolved before the Summit Meeting in Minsk.
Naturally, there are great expectations from the German side and throughout European and the world. All of the participants need to be aware that tomorrow we will have a major opportunity to take a first important step towards the de-escalation of the crisis and move towards the ceasefire. But I repeat and stress that nothing has been gained yet. The fact that this meeting is taking place does not guarantee its success. That is why I hope that Moscow and Kiev will approach the situation seriously, in view of the looming threat of military conflict, and seize this opportunity. When one bears in mind the messages of the news agencies, the situation continues to be unstable, the military clash is continuing. I say this stressing and adding that this is wouldn’t be the first time an act of political sabotage was aimed at squandering all hope of a ceasefire. So I hope that none of the participants pushes the situation to extremes, raising the specter of uncontrolled violence. We will do everything possible to find a political solution. Political solutions may be the only thing being sought at this time, leading to a lasting de-escalation and ceasefire. This is the only hope, because peace is the only choice for this region.
Thank you.
N. KOTZIAS: Thank you. I would like to express particular thanks for this very kind invitation. I return to a country where I studied and where my daughter lived for 14 years. The journalists haven’t discovered that yet; they’ve only discovered my wife. But I share their taste for discovery.
I am pleased to be in Berlin and to have the opportunity to talk to Minister Steinmeier about the new political prospects of the new Greek government. I think that we have a lot of common ground with Germany, and there are many issues we should look at. You are aware that dialogue, debates are the weapons of democracy, and through the talks we can impart momentum to our friendship, raising some questions and observations that can be raised.
In Athens we believe that the policy carried out over the past five years led only to failures. We have a major social crisis. We have hundreds of thousands of people who cannot pay for electricity, who live in the cold; thousands of people committing suicide, 1.5 million unemployed, nearly 60% youth unemployment. What we hope is that, in cooperation with our friends in Germany and in the EU, we will succeed in giving hope back to our country, with Greeks regaining their self-respect. Because, whatever the economics textbook says, without people there cannot be development and progress. And we want to give people this positive impression: that there is a future.
We need reforms. The Greek government has undersigned precisely this: that we need reforms. However, it undersigned other reforms, not reforms that are to the detriment of the majority of the Greek people and were imposed on this basis, but reforms that will fight tax evasion, the oligarchy that has learned to draw its wealth from the national wealth. So we need major reforms that will put an end to this misdistribution.
Because, essentially, even the laws of capitalism are not in effect in Greece. We are the only country where, after six years of profound crisis, not a single oligarch has lost his business or had his business collapse. This is unprecedented in history. So we hope to have Europe’s support on this reform programme. Because it is a social justice programme and responds to the hopes and aspirations of the Greek people.
We will discuss the future of Europe. We are a force in favor of Europe, friendly towards Europe. Europe, if we just look at its name, exists simply because some crazy Greek god abducted this beautiful girl. This is the essential foundation of Europe: understanding, solidarity, love. This is expressed through Greek mythology.
But like the German government, we too are deeply concerned at the destabilization within Europe with the crisis in Ukraine, in Syria, in Iraq; the resurgence of jihadist terrorism. We hope that, together with Germany, we will be able to contribute to the stabilization of all of these regions, which are essentially an arc running from eastern Europe to the Near East and to North Africa.
So our heartfelt support goes to Germany’s initiative for the quadrilateral meeting, and we are of the view that in Minsk we should discuss the implementation of the Minsk decisions. There is no other solution. For us, this solution towards peace and stability is the only solution. And, naturally, without there being a rift between Europe and Russia.
Naturally, we will talk about the issue of the Greek debt. Reading the German press, I feel that I should make it clear that what we are asking for, entreating for – choose whatever word you want – is understanding.
We cannot continue the policy that was imposed on us, because our society is collapsing, our productive base has almost vanished, and economic growth is not possible. And without economic growth, the debts cannot be repaid. Germany is well aware of this, having experienced the agreements of 1952-1953. What we want to discuss today is the implementation of a different policy that will lead to growth and inspire the Greek people to participate in this process and not to look on in apathy as their country collapses.
Naturally, we will talk about the issue of reparations. I am, if you will, a postman for the Hellenic Parliament. I know this issue is getting a lot of attention in the press. We rank the issues differently, but I will mention it anyway.
Thank you very much for giving me the opportunity to return to the country of my wife and my daughter.
JOURNALIST: A question for the Greek Foreign Minister: What specific demands will you raise with Berlin regarding the reparations issue?
Mr. Steinmeier, in Greece one wonders why Greece is being stigmatized as not paying its debt, while in essence Germany is the one that didn’t repay the occupation loan.
N. KOTZIAS: I come to Berlin with the part of the Prime Minister’s speech that refers to the reparations. And everything said, in detail – in the Hellenic Parliament and the platform speeches during the debate on the vote of confidence in the government – is on the Foreign Ministry website.
I think it is particularly important that we stress that our approval rate is at record levels – over 72-74%. The reason we are so popular – And I have no worries as to our continuing to be in the long term – is not just our political views, but also the fact that we want to bring hope back to our country.
F. W. STEINMEIER: Europeans have a lot of questions about the events and horrible crimes that happened during World War II. One of the most important responses they have given, that Europe has given, was the unification of Europe. We, the Germans, are aware of our share of the political and moral responsibility for the terrible events that took place in Greece from 1941 to 1944. I believe that in Greece one remembers well the words of the President of the German Republic, who expressed himself with the appropriate words.
But it isn’t just words. From the preparation of the visit and during the visit, ideas were engendered, ideas that are already being implemented, like the idea of the Greek-German Youth Center and the Greek-German Fund for the Future. As for the questions regarding the past, which always touch us, and which probably haven't yet met with the right historical processing – they haven’t yet been processed that way – there is no issue. However, from a legal standpoint, in our opinion, nothing changes. We remain firm in our view that all of the questions regarding reparations and the forced occupation loan have been settled definitively from a legal standpoint.
JOURNALIST: Do you support the view of your colleague Mr. Kammenos, who said this morning that, if Germany continues to refuse to show understanding regarding the difficult situation Greece is in, there is a plan B for finding other supporters – other creditors – and if this is the case, are you already negotiating with other countries, and which country do you prefer?
N. KOTZIAS: My preference is Europe. And I hope that Europe understands that this is our preference. I will once again reiterate what I have already said: The issue is not whether or not we will pay our debts, as was discussed, but whether we will implement another policy that is more socially just and helps growth. Mr. Kammenos was thinking aloud. I am of the view that we should negotiate and discuss things with the EU and Germany. Naturally, we will listen to all the sides that show us their solidarity and, so that there should be no misunderstanding, those sides that believe that there needs to be a different, European solution; another solution, and not one like the one we have had (to date). The main thing for me, as the Foreign Minister, is that my colleagues and our partners should see us as partners with equal rights. Over the past five years, we have had only failures. Being poor doesn’t mean not having rights. The poor, too, have the right to vote and share in decisions.
February 11, 2015